MAngband

I'm curious to see what the players think. I lean towards #2 myself.<br><br>1) Leave it as-is.<br>2) Make Destruction not break down vault walls, and always destroy all items and non-rock-eating (granitarian?) monsters in the radius.

mmm.. I have another idea
If the square turns to rock, the item is destroyed.. otherwise, it survives?  That would add some randomness to it.. (Go ahead, destro that vault, but you'll probably lose that purple [   )

Good idea, but instead of having destro totally destroy all monsters in the area, it might do a certain (very high) damage to all monsters. This may not be a very good idea, as many of the high level players use destro to avoid bad situations. However, it may also be useful fo taking out alot of the HP's of a high unique, as well as removing all summoned monsters. This way, monsters would still drop and you would still get the XP.

I think avengers idea is nice but hey, i think destruction is good as it is..... so uhhhm i leave it to you

Leave Destruction as is.....

That way, vault crackers can decide on going in -

think that the idea of destruction just being a
wave of destruction that obliterates everything
in the radius is the best

Just out of curiosity, does earthquake work the same way currently destroying all objects and monsters?

Earthquake works completely differently - it does
not destroy all monsters all items.

Earthquake will not crack permarock either - which makes it good for entering vaults through the granite
veins.

This is what i think needs to be done with destruction, we should have 2 scrolls, a destruction and a *destruction*, destruction scrolls should be as cheap and do the same thing it traditionally does as before, *destruction* scrolls should destroy everything but leave items, and they should be a heck of alot more expensive, like 25k each or higher in the bm, that way low level players have a safe way of saving their butt and high lvl players can upgrade to the better scroll.  I think that would be awsome, cause personally, i really miss having a cheap source of safety.

Right now, *Destruction* (Destroying all monsters) is the only "safe" escape method high level players have.  

Currently, with hound/caster breathing methods, it doesn't matter how carefully you play.. hit 3k or deeper long enough and you WILL end up in a pack of nasty hounds with the capability to kill you in mere seconds  sooner or later.  With the large amount of monsters deep in the dungeon, teleport can be very deadly.

However, I believe cheap *Destruction* scrolls available in the BM as they used to be on Berendol's server really messes with the balance of the game.  
Should all low level players really be able to buy a fail-safe escape method?  Teleport staves are 4-5k each in *6*, and *destruction* is much superior.  It'd take most of the fun out of playing low level chars.  Walk around, *Destro* whenever something bad happens.

Just some thoughts...

Maegdae, I'd really appreciate it if you'd mention major imbalances *BEFORE* you start abusing them, not *AFTER* I remove them because I got sick of watching you abuse them.

Sorry
I was just trying to put a concise explanation of why some ideas put forth could have bad consequences.  
I think your statement might be a little harsh considering that any abusing I might do is un-intentionaly done while playtesting on an unfinished server. I read the rules regularly and try to follow the letter and spirit.  Please forgive me; I'll try to be more careful in the future.  

Don't pretend like you don't abuse imbalances for fun. I have watched you blissfully scumming for that stuff a few times. One of the bonuses of an invisible RNG is that I can watch potential trouble as it arises. You'll understand my frustration someday. This is important, and if you gain nothing else from this post, learn this: You are to report imbalances as you see them (ie immediately) and if I tell you in-game to post something you said, I mean it, because I don't keep track of everything people tell me in the game.

Now... I see the point you're trying to make specifically to me in your newly changed sigblock, which for posterity is something like "why shouldn't children make all possible mistakes so they learn all possible things." The idea is that children (such as yourself) learn to stop making mistakes and intelligently see new and unexplored mistakes coming, and avoid them, rather than having to make these unforeseen mistakes and learn the hard way. It's known as common sense, and in some aspects wisdom. Come on, I don't want to be a parent or an advisor to you. Go talk to them about these things instead of me.

My final words on the subject are: Please pay attention to section 2.1 (Disputes not covered by the rules) where it says "If a dispute arises over something not covered by the rules, the administrator will have the final say in the matter." Further conversation on this topic must be moved to another topic, otherwise consider it closed.

well, if you don't want the destr so cheap, i still say we have a regular destruct, and one that saves items, even if the regular is 8k or so and the other is 100k for really high lvl players only, it could be an item to carry in your mile down club, anyway, i really like the idea of 2 different ones

heh while I dont play on Ber's server I must say that a Destro that saves objects would be pretty limp regardless of a 100k pricetag.  Money becomes irrelevant soon enough that 100k wouldn't matter.  Think about it.. combine such an object with geno/mass geno and you just removed the last obsticle (hard uniques) to free gear in deep vault scumming.

I'm gonna have to agree with Domino again here. Although I believe money is valuable for much longer than it used to be, you'll hit item saturation sometime. I don't want any kind of destruction to preserve items. If you call destruction from wherever it comes from, you should probably even take the risk of it affecting you! Heck, try out one of the new clone wands when the server's back online! Maybe splitting the current destruction into Lesser Destruction and Greater Destruction would help, where the radius is the only difference. Hmm...